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You've always approached your albums as such complete, singular
works. What was it like pulling them apart and reconfiguring these
songs?
All the albums I've done exist and will continue to exist in that form. But I
was really inspired by the Zeppelin remasters in 1992. Some people can get it
right. And sometimes you can really screw up something that was better left
untouched. But there's technology now that didn't exist then, so no matter how
good George Martin and the engineers were, there are things that can be
improved.
The actual compiling of the work was key, so that certain work wasn't
competing with others. When I finish an album, as narrative, that needs to live.
But it's a sonic exhibition, a sonic installation. If you're going to MoMA and
you see an artist that you haven't seen for a long time, that Chagall can affect
you very differently because of what you see around it. I
was surprised that there's not one cover version on this collection. Your covers
have been such a recurrent part of your career, including the entire
"Strange Little Girls" album, which
isn't represented here.
I felt that "A Piano" needed to come from the piano as a composer with a
woman. This is a representation of me as a singer/songwriter. Me as an
interpretive performer is not what this was about. This had to not be me pushing
up on somebody else's scene.
A box set has to have 20 years -- or for some people, 30 or 40 years -- of
work behind it. I have a lot of pride in that work ethic, that I could generate
this much material. So the box was about original ideas coming from a piano.
Live performance is different -- that can be about music that inspired me, and
having been a piano bar player for so long, that's another facet to the
artistry. In the booklet, you write about how resistant you
have always been to the idea of releasing any of your demos or songs in
progress. Why did you decide to do it in the end?
That was the closest Mark (producer and husband Mark Hawley) and I ever came
to the word "divorce." I say that tongue in cheek, because the best part of our
relationship -- well, one of the best parts -- is that when we get confused, the
professional side takes over. And he said, I won't be doing my job unless I vote
for the demos to make this box set -- it's imperative. To me, it's similar to
showing your sonogram pictures to the Internet.
Neil Gaiman (science-fiction writer and sometime Amos collaborator) and I
talk about this all the time. He really exposes his process and doesn't feel
like he's giving himself away. But if you ask me what songs I'm listening to now
as I compile the ideas for the new album, I wouldn't tell you. What goes on as
you make a CD is as sacred as what goes on in the bedroom.
In the end, we did think that the demos would give people the idea that you
don't just sit down and record a finished piece of music, you really have to
work for it. Part of me has been very inspired by reading about how Max Ernst or
Georgia O'Keefe achieved results without ripping off their platelets. I had some
of that in the book I did with Ann Powers. So we thought the demos might help
prove a point to young songwriters that want to give up because they don't
achieve it.
Bob Dylan has often spoken about
feeling like a transmitter for his songs. Finally, though, in the "Chronicles"
book, he started to address the fact that it's also a lot of sweat and hard work
to get them done.
You do see yourself as a conduit, a transmitter, just because of ego issues.
Songwriters who think it's all about them can't keep it together for 20, 30
years because the hubris takes over.
So how does it feel to listen to the demos on the box?
Oh, I don't listen to that part. I can't. But that's OK. The artist in me
can't, but the producer can and not blink an eye.
I really have to divide myself to make the decisions that the artist can't.
As the years have progressed, it's gotten easier to tell the performer to leave
the room. Since albums, and narratives, are so important to
you and your music, how do you feel about the new digital world and the fact
that your catalog can be cherry-picked in whichever way a listener
wants?
Steve Jobs has too much control. To call it iTunes and not have iAlbums -- I
don't like being railroaded. It should be the artists' choice how people hear
the work initially, even if it means losing half of their sales. Choosing just
some of the songs is like walking into a top restaurant and telling the chef, "I
want to pick the ingredients apart and make it this way."
It's a narrative -- if you cut up "War and Peace" and just sell it chapter by
chapter, I don't know that those writers would have agreed to that. "OK,
Charlie, let's sell these few pages of 'David Copperfield,' we'll just let
people take what they want ... ." I don't think so. [Editor's note: Charles
Dickens did make "David Copperfield" available in installments.]
Jobs has done a great thing. But I think it's dangerous, and if he's really a
great man, really a genius, he needs to understand that maybe iTunes could
expand its thinking, and maybe it could even get better. Let this be taken by
creative minds as a way to grow, not as an insult. I'm not stupid, I'm not
trying to cut myself off from the entire digital community.
I have a friend, a young student, who is a huge Tori fan. She bought
"A Piano" because it wasn't on iTunes when it first came out, but she told me
that if she could have waited and downloaded the "Bonus B-Sides" disc, and saved
the money, that's what she would have done.
Well, I can't be held hostage as an artist to the fact that she doesn't have
the cash. Maybe 10 years from now she'll have more money than any of us, who
knows?
I'm a motherf***er, and the reason she likes me is that you can't guilt me
into saying what she wants to hear to make her day. I am going to stand by what
I want for the songs, period.
I wasn't going to let this box set become "Boxing Helena" in the first six
weeks. I knew that I would deliver what she needs, but no way was I going to let
the sonic perverts cut up this music.
I don't make singles, I make albums. I don't shoot just one crotch shot --
that's not what I do. I'll give you the crotch shot -- but at least put me in a
pair of Louboutin high heels.
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